Intelligent debate requires knowing all of the...

Intelligent debate requires knowing all of the facts

On April 27, Jay Baker of Corona del Mar wrote to the Daily Pilot

that there are supporters of the war on terrorism (“War on terrorism

has its supporters, as well”). Baker demeans Joseph Bell for

listening to, and understanding, a couple of ex-military officers who

have experience in the field.

It is from experience that knowledge can be derived from, and

history gives us many valuable lessons. We can learn from past

mistakes to not repeat those mistakes, and we can learn from

experience how to improve on those things that we did well.

Of course, we all are against terrorism, whether it is Saudi men

hijacking planes and flying them into the World Trade Center or

Timothy McVeigh blowing up the federal building in Oklahoma City.

I am afraid Baker has been listening to the “neocons” espousing

inaccuracies and flat-out lies. First of all, Baker says Saddam

Hussein dictated the millions of mass murders of his own people with

chemical weapons and torture chambers. This plainly is incorrect.

Yes, Saddam did use chemical weapons on the Kurds, but Saddam never

thought of them as his own people. Reading a little about history and

the Middle East would help Baker.

And millions of people? Where the heck did he get that from? He

sure did not get that figure from President Bush or even any of the

neocons. The problem with Baker, is he seems to refuse to read and

learn the facts. If he would turn off the television and stop

listening to the sound bites he would be better informed if you

actually read what the facts are.

Next Baker says the Iraqi people begged for our help. Who did this

and when? I cannot find one news article that substantiates this

fantasy. Maybe he saw somebody on television who said this? Or maybe

he was listening to Rush Limbaugh?

The next falsehood is that Saddam is connected to the Sept. 11,

2001 terrorist attacks. The vice president initially said this was

so. He said this on television thus it must be true. Even he has

backed off this statement. But forget the fact that the Central

Intelligence Agency, and all the other intelligence agencies in the

world, said this was not true, and to this day it is still out of the

realm of imagination if one listens to the facts.

Of course, Baker would not want the facts to interfere with his

opinions.

We went to war to stop Hussein’s weapons of mass destruction.

Again, there was never any proof or facts, and there still isn’t, to

substantiate this accusation. Iraq has oil, so what other reason do

we need? North Korea has weapons of mass destruction programs that we

know about, have known about, and these programs are a real threat to

world peace. But they have no oil. Anyway, what kind of contracts

could Halliburton get in North Korea? Democracy? This whole thing is

about money.

Baker can use any reasoning, excuses and lies to justify the

deaths of American soldiers in Iraq because he believes what he

watches on television. But if it was his son or daughter over there

maybe he would think twice about the facts.

Liberty and democracy demand and support different opinions on all

issues. When someone does not support -- as they see it -- lies and

deception and speaks out against it, they now are called unpatriotic

and un-American. Baker should read the Constitution of the United

States and the Bill of Rights and reflect upon what the Nazis did

before and during World War II, in the name of patriotism and

defending their country, by denying freedom of expression and the

their use of propaganda and limiting of information to control public

opinion.

PAUL JAMES BALDWIN

Newport Beach

Marinapark phone survey results should be public

I also responded to the phone survey that John Dowden referred to

in his letter published on April 25 (“Phone survey measures

Marinapark merits”). My questioner said the survey was being paid for

by the city of Newport Beach. I wonder if the survey results will be

made available for the citizens to review?

EDWARD LYON

Newport Beach